Request! A Post About The Environment

[crankyoldman]

Requested by first_seventhe because she clearly wants to get me in trouble. Sorry for the spam, I just have nothing to do atm.

So, um, alright. Just to get it out of the way, I don't believe in global warming.



BUT, before anyone starts yelling at me, this doesn't mean you should go around in a gas guzzler and litter and shit. I'll even be so bold as to say I'm probably a hell of a lot more environment conscious than a lot of the annoying yuppie hippies that I usually hear crap from (which doesn't include anyone on my f-list, mind you). I think the main problem with how we treat the environment is how we treat ourselves, that is, single-serving. Our cars, food, lives are very much me-centered. Think about it.

I only dislike global warming theory because most times, there are huge glaring scientific errors of thought that sort of make me stop listening to them. Like, for instance, that when the ice caps melt, the water level will go up. Now, I may suck at thermodynamics and chemistry, but ice has MORE volume than water, which is why when shit freezes in the cracks on streets it sucks when everything thaws, because it makes the cracks bigger. That's just one example. My biologist sister who knows a helluva lot more than I do about such things is even more vocal than I am about it being false.

I do think we are jackasses about waste, though.

I live in a dorm, which means I get to see some of the most lazy wasteful people in action. Come on, you can't walk down the frigging hall to throw a can in the specially marked can recycling bin?! Shit, I've been recycling since I was about, well, five, and we lived in THE MIDDLE OF NOWHERE. We didn't have curbside trash pickup, let alone recycling pickup. Sorting through our recycling so that the local recycler place wouldn't reject it was actually a chore in my household. I actually can't throw a can away without feeling... really really bad. It's been conditioned into me. Want to make a bad first impression on me? Throw a can in the trash. I nearly got up in someone's face over them doing this (and in this case THE FUCKING RECYCLE BIN WAS RIGHT NEXT TO THE DAMN TRASHCAN).

It's alright to be worried about our dependency on petroleum, but whatever you do, don't trade your car for a hybrid. Making hybrids involves a caustic process that may very well poison your drinking water. I happen to like not dying from the water, personally. Get a catalytic converter for your lawn mower instead. And if you REALLY want to end the dependency on oil, just stop buying plastic materials.

Really. Most oil is actually used to make plastics, not power cars. I'm not kidding you.

I guess what I'd really like to see is people being less... stupidly hypocritical about the environment. You know? Like when I see an environmental plate on an SUV I sort of wish bad things on them. Or people that get all uppity and shit about other people needing to change their lifestyles. You know what? People won't give a rat's ass unless you give them a cheaper alternative. Welcome to capitalism. I also really am rather annoyed by people that go back completely to nature. That's not helping! That's not progress. Sure, some things we could go back to (like maybe being able to pay attention to one thing at a time) but completely backpedaling is totally not going to do shit for what's going on. If you can take the principles from way back and make something that's new, cheap, effective? THEN you've made a difference.

Hell, I don't even think my finicky recycling and general attempts to get by on public transport and bikes and walking is doing anything more than making myself feel better.

So I guess in short, my thoughts on the environment is that we are idiots about taking care of it because we like everything personalized. But since my faith in humanity is lost when it comes to socialism, we just have to be smarter about the shit that can be thrown away and being aware of where it goes. Also, to stop drinking bottled water and get yourself a filter. REALLY.

...And I'm totally never mentioning this again.

Comments

[venefica-aura.livejournal.com]

The unfortunate truth about those is they are either 1. Hella expensive or 2. the process to make them almost cancels out the good they do.

I'm holding out for a real solution. The water vapor one comes close, hopefully they can figure out a good manufacture process. Prototypes are all well and good, but unless they're commercially viable they're nothing impressive?

~Cendri

[first-seventhe.livejournal.com]

I just want to support the IDEA of fuel-efficient cars, y'know? At this point in my life I'm not worried about cost-efficiency. if I have to spend a little more money to let my dollars make the point that I want a fuel-efficient car that helps the environment, then so be it. A sort of "every little bit counts" thing.

Then again, if it's not really helping the environment I certainly don't want one. I'll have to look into that. I have probably until next year (unless Goldbug dies early D: )

I'll admit, the reason I was interested in this post was because I'm a closet, lazy treehugger myself. "Closet" and "lazy" because I just don't have the activist personality - I don't like PEOPLE enough to be an activist on pretty much anything - and because I know I'm limited and can only do so much. But I like doing small things myself in the hopes that I can balance out the bad things I'm inadvertantly doing to the planet by doing some small good things.

Also because I like hearing nerdy engineers ramble. XD

[venefica-aura.livejournal.com]

Then again, if it's not really helping the environment I certainly don't want one. I'll have to look into that. I have probably until next year (unless Goldbug dies early D: )

The car itself is good, the manufacture is not and in fact worse than making an internal combustion car. I was reading through my dad's IEEE magazine about that. The only way to make enough hydrogen would mean nuclear reactors to make enough heat to separate it from water. The amount of CO2 released in addition to the caustic chemicals that poison water to make the engine are really not worth it.

It's a lovely concept, but it's not easily implemented on a large scale without making it zero-sum. I think we're stuck in a half-step, with popular science telling us that greenhouse gases are the real problem, when in fact our amount of consumption in general is. It's not bad to cut down trees, as long as you grow enough back. It's not bad to throw things away as long as you can make stuff from them.

Also, YOU may not worry about cost effectiveness, but unless it's something that most people can afford, you are really doing nothing. Even buying it won't do anything because you're just the group that can afford it.

I mean, I may sound rather skeptical, but that's only because even in something as fun as educational gaming, shit does not make a difference unless it is marketable. I mean, your whole "the cost doesn't count" type of thinking misses the point. It's like saying "let's just quandruple the price of cars so that only certain people can afford them".

Europe did that. They don't have mass transport because it's better, they did it because they forced a two class system.

And the US really wouldn't go for that because we are an individualistic culture. It means you get stupidheads and idiots at times, but then it also means there's less of a class system. It's there, because despite the fact that anyone can technically start from nothing few people have the right combination of will and education to do so, but that's crazy sociology theory that I read too much on.

Really, reducing the amount of stuff you throw away and your dependency on plastics (particularly the flimsy kind that can't be recycled) is the best thing you can do for the environment. If you're so guilty about your car, carpool. Or bike. Or walk. But that requires you to lose your independence a little, doesn't it?

~Cendri

[first-seventhe.livejournal.com]

It's a lovely concept, but it's not easily implemented on a large scale without making it zero-sum.

This is the problem with everything, really -- and it's the first thing you learn in thermodynamics: nothing comes for free. There are costs and drawbacks to everything and until either (a) somebody comes up with the next totally awesome magical energy source or (b) saving the planet becomes econnomically feasible*, there's not going to be a good solution.

(I mean, the first thing you learn about in Chem-E is the Carnot Engine. As bad as it may be, there's a reason we're still using that basic system rather than a fuel cell.)

And hey, I've been pushing to carpool with Jeff for a year and a half now. >.>


*Which is the key. I agree with you. Why are so many Americans still fat? Because it's cheap to eat at McDonalds. Economics: the driver.

[venefica-aura.livejournal.com]

It IS the problem with a lot of things. XD

And dude, my history class goes over a lot of energy related things because my teacher is a hippie.

Suggested readings that may interest you:

Cool It! (a fantastic book from an economist about the global warming idea that does not go the "sky is falling!" route)

This fun article that popped up in my feedreader today. (http://io9.com/368777/how-to-build-an-ecotopian-society)

You also might like No Impact Man (http://noimpactman.typepad.com/). I used to read him, but he goes a little on the anti-progress route, and I want a progressive approach to no impact, not this stupid "let's go back to living in caves!" thing that a lot of environmentalists take.

~Cendri

[first-seventhe.livejournal.com]

And yes. The main roadblock to hydrogen fuel cell cars is, well, the fuel cell. As they're built right now they're very fragile - the membranes can easily break, rip, whatever, just from a hot spot in the process, and then BAM! no car! So they're very much still in the research-stage of industrial processing. They reallly only made the prototypes in California for publicity, and to try and get money. Not saying that they shouldn't have - I think it was a fantastic idea - but it's a little unreal to think we'll have them in the next few years. There's basically no way.

There are other types of fuel cells (solid oxide, methanol, etc) that get less press but are closer to commercialization, I believe. They're probably not as "clean sounding" as the "water vapor car" and so no one knows about them.

This is great. Fuel Cell talk always hits my hot buttons because I worked there for so long. 2 years in academia and 1+ in industry.